Archive 1 ~ 17 February 2009 to October 5, 2009


When is the last time "Chaos" has contributed? I'd like to know if it's possible to have my name shortened, please. ---Chaos- (talk) -- 15:50, October 4, 2009 (UTC)

August 2009, sorry. Angela (talk) 22:46, October 4, 2009 (UTC)


First I would like to say thank you for this great site. Second Archive. Third Can you help?----X 18:43, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

There are no recent edits by anyone called Xtreme1 or Xtreme. Do you know if he's using a different name here? Angela (talk) 20:58, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
My user name here is Xtreme1ne....on GWW it is Xtreme1----X 21:12, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
Sorry, I just figured that out. I'm not really awake yet! The problem is one of the server IPs is showing up as user IPs. I'll report this to ops and get that fixed. It sometimes happens when a new server is added. Angela (talk) 21:18, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
Are you thinking it is a North American bug? (just wondering)----X 21:13, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
No, it affects anyone editing if they happen to land on a certain server. Angela (talk) 21:18, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
Okay then why dose it seem to be directed at me and always me?----X 21:46, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
"If the happen to land on a certain server" you was the unlucky one xtreme! --Frosty Frostcharge.jpg 21:48, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
The latest problem is not server related. More on User talk:Xtreme1ne. Angela (talk) 21:52, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
I added a note there Angela, it's not resulting from banning people who share an IP with Xtreme. Checkuser shows nothing and the bans are one-directional. It's pretty weird. Misery Cow.pngMisery Says Moo 22:16, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

While you are here, I think, what do you think about this IP (check user it), this IP has edits from 11 different users, all different people. I was thinking it was ISP based, but could it be something on wikia side? If you don't know down't worry, it's not all that important.
I was also wondering if TOR has given up on our skill database, or if something has come up, since we was told it would be fixed somewhere in the summer, and it's now November with no word from him. Any chance of something happening along those lines or are we doomed to out of date skill descriptions! --Frosty Frostcharge.jpg 21:48, November 9, 2009 (UTC) is the server IP that was used for a day or 2 in October by accident. Does the skill database just need updating or is it broken? Angela (talk) 21:52, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
It needs updating, and it has for quite a while. --Frosty Frostcharge.jpg 22:14, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
User:Frosty/Skills2 I don't know if you can pass this on to TOR or something, I left him a message on the main wikia page but didn't get a respone, that's a list of all the skills that are incorrect. --Frosty Frostcharge.jpg 22:24, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
I've filed this as a ticket now as talk page messages often get lost. Angela (talk) 22:54, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

Skill database

Hey Angela! I'm sure you've probably got a few (or more) mentions of this recently via whatever means. Basically the skill database is currently out of date (i can't say how out of date, i don't keep too close an eye on that >.>).

I do recall however that the database has to be updated manually (at least given that it's out of date, and from what we last heard i assume it still is). We did suggest a couple of possiable solutions to this ~when we moved (roughly). One suggestion was to have a couple of/few pages (that would be protected so only admins could edit), that had the database entries on, and then the admins could update these pages when needed, and the pages could be synced with the database every so often (updates occur every other month now I believe, so on the first of every other month for example).

While it's not the greatest solution, it would ensure that the skill database is kept relatively up to date, and it wouldn't require much input from any wikia staff (the only part staff would be needed for is syncing the database).

Sorry to rant on (and sorry if this is perhaps a bit more apt. for TOR). ~ PheNaxKian talk 22:11, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

Tor started work on this yesterday and hopefully will find time on Friday to do more. I can't estimate when it will be finished though. Angela (talk) 23:13, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
Thanks, knowing it's being worked on will do =). Thanks again. ~ PheNaxKian talk 23:18, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
Don't forget to say thanks Phen :< Thunda Sig 2.pngPimpstronghand 00:52, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

Moving the Skill Database to PvX

Frosty had the idea of asking you guys if there's any possible way we could move the skills database ([1], [2], [3], [4]) over to PvX and protecting it so only admins could edit them. Would that be possible? I know it would take a work-load off of TOR and they're only text files, so they wouldn't be that complicated for us to update.
If that's not an option, is there a way we could edit the text files (or format them) and email them to TOR, so we can be assured that our skills are updating on time and take the pressure off of him? Thanks. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 20:32, 14 November 2009

I've suggested that to Tor. Angela (talk) 23:25, November 14, 2009 (UTC)
Thanks, Angela. I really hope that's an option. We'd love to be able to control our skill database, and we know that he's pretty swamped. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 00:08, 15 November 2009
Any news on this, Angela? I know you guys probably take the weekend off, but I'm just wanting to know what the decision is on moving the skills here. Thanks :D Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 23:11, 16 November 2009
Unfortunately, it looks like Tor cannot easily give access to sysops, as this could be a potential security risk. However, the db files will be updated today. Angela (talk) 21:56, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
Thanks, Angela. What about my other suggestion? Would TOR be interested in us emailing him corrected versions of our skill database (since we can see them now)? I'm sure we have a few dedicated people willing to email those to him in the text format when our skills become outdated. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 21:58, 17 November 2009
Like me, the code can't be too hard. ---Chaos- (talk) -- 22:01, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
I still think it wouldn't be too bad if we just had copies of those 4 pages on here (protected for admin only) and a staff member Syncs it occasionally =/ ~ PheNaxKian talk 22:03, November 17, 2009 (UTC)

Um...they may be worse now

Just a heads up, the skill database seems even more borked than it was before. If you have time, take a look at these pages User:Frosty/Skills2/User:Frosty/Skills2 (PvP).
Now many of our skills are not scaling correctly and the PvP skills that TOR created don't show up at all (even though they're in the database).
For example, <pvxbig>[Illusion of Pain@12]</pvxbig> <pvxbig></pvxbig>
Illusion of Pain should be scaling because I have it set at 12 and Assassin's Remedy (PvP) doesn't appear at all (even though that's exactly how it's listed on the db). Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 03:28, 18 November 2009

I realized why the PvP skill variantions are not appearing. TOR forgot to update this names in the db. Could you let him know? Thanks. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 03:31, 18 November 2009
I will, but it's quicker if you use special:contact. Angela (talk) 04:55, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
Do you still want me to use that to contact TOR, or should I just do it next time? Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 04:56, 18 November 2009
Just next time :) Angela (talk) 05:27, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
This should be fixed now. Angela (talk) 13:55, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
Lovely. Many, however, still doesn't scale.. I to nag because we're all human beings ;o ---Chaos- (talk) -- 14:17, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
also, the newly created PvP skills don't have the thumbnail image of the skill in the popup/mouse-over box >.> ~ PheNaxKian talk 14:18, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
/sigh. I'll contact TOR again. Could someone try to get a list together? Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 16:08, 18 November 2009


Can I have it? I'm an admin now. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 22:22, 18 November 2009

I'm not sure what the policies on this wiki are relating to checkuser. It's not usually a decision that would be made by staff. Angela (talk) 23:18, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
generally after an someone has been an admin for about a month the BCrats would give them checkuser, though I don't think it's necessary to wait a month (it was like a break in period I guess =p) ~ PheNaxKian talk 23:21, November 18, 2009 (UTC)

Just bumping this issue. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 20:29, 23 November 2009

I think you need to talk to a local bureaucrat about this. Angela (talk) 20:46, November 23, 2009 (UTC)
Already have. Auron is our only active bureaucrat and he said it's fine (but he can't grant checkuser) Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 20:51, 23 November 2009
Sorry, I thought bureaucrats could do that. You now have those rights. Angela (talk) 21:25, November 23, 2009 (UTC)
Thanks Angela. For some reason, our bcrats can't. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 21:30, 23 November 2009
It's currently setup so that bureaucrats can remove checkusers but cannot add checkusers. --Charitwo (talk) 21:57, November 23, 2009 (UTC)
Ah, thanks Charitwo. And also thanks for helping with that vandal yesterday. Karate KJ for sig.png Jesus 22:19, 23 November 2009
You're welcome, anytime. --Charitwo (talk) 22:22, November 23, 2009 (UTC)

I also don't have checkuser even though I'm an admin. Sorry for missing this somehow when you were granting it to KJ. ToraenTheJanitorToraenSig2.png 23:04, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

There seems to either 1. Be missing options in my admin account or 2. I'm slow. Toraen, a more active admin than myself and Frosty, has no checkuser. This isn't too great of a problem, as we typically have several admins logged in at once, but it would be great if you got to it asap (I know you're busy :p). Also regarding our database issues, can you at least allow the site Bureaucrats to access it to fine-tune our template and skill icon problems? I know this is a lot to ask, but I'm just doing it out of a renewed interest in the maintenance side of this Wiki. Thanks in advance for any response, and Prospero Ano y Felicidad. Mcbig.png sysop 23:19, December 5, 2009 (UTC)

Hi, I've left a comment on this at PvXwiki:Wikia noticeboard -- sannse (talk) 02:11, December 15, 2009 (UTC)

Assurances broken

I would like to know why once again the assurances that you made to us before the move to Wikia are being broken, as outlined here and here. I have explained previously why checkuser was required on this wiki, yet it seems that moves are being made again to restrict or remove its use. We were told that the running of this wiki would be left to us, yet a Wikia staff member has stepped in and largely arbitrarily removed user rights through selective reading of discussion. I would rather not have the same argument every six months as to why we need checkuser on this wiki and I would also prefer to not have to continuously fight for what we already have and were told we could retain. Could you please work to resolve this matter and try to prevent it from happening again and again? Misery Cow.pngMisery Says Moo 09:45, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but I did not promise that new users would continue to be granted this right after the move. It's not something that Wikia is prepared to hand out so liberally. Angela (talk) 11:58, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
No, what you promised is that the running of the wiki would be left to the community. I consider this a significant level of meddling in the affairs of the wiki. Misery Cow.pngMisery Says Moo 12:22, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
I don't think this needs to affect the running of the community as some people still have access to the checkuser tool. Please understand that being able to look up private details like a person's IP address can have legal implications which is one of the reasons we want to be careful about this. If you look at policies on other wikis such as Wikipedia, the rules are much more strict - people need to send the office proof of their identity before they can have access to the tool. Angela (talk) 12:49, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
And how does removing those rights from people who already had the tools and have in some cases for years help anything? In fact as far as I can tell Uberfuzzy agreed to restore the rights if anyone became "active" again. Seeing as being active or inactive is simply a flag set voluntarily by sysops I could say "I am active, can I have it back please" right now if I wanted to. If Wikia wants confirmation of identity for everyone with checkuser, that's a separate issue. Misery Cow.pngMisery Says Moo 14:47, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
Technically, you guys did promise that the running and policies of PvX would be left to us, and according to our policies our Bcrats decide user rights (including: checkuser and bot status, neither of which they can grant). KarateCandy!.pngJesus 15:50, 18 December 2009


I'll try to explain why we need it thoroughly and concisely, and if I'm missing out on something then please point it out. I'll just mash this wall of text here for future reference and visibility. These things mentioned are in no way speculation, and such events occur regularly.

  • Vandalism
    • We have a massive amount of vandals, and the nature of the wiki being as it is, active users too might feel like vandalizing something in the spirit of the lovely joke. I could point out many incidents of my own and others, even one from within the last day or two, where checkusering would easily have given away the person for circumventing a ban.
    • People get banned (and proxy) on a regular basis here. Even the people we accept as admins, and especially our build masters deserve a ban every now and then.
  • Vetting procedure and socks
    • A build is put into a category (0-3.74=trash, 3.75-4.7.4=good, 4.75-5=great) once it has gotten 5 votes. People are in general very biased toward their own builds, and since having made many builds is a show of status (since vetting even one can be quite hard), and people are very stubborn about the qualities of the build, it comes to asking friends to vote favorably, or creating a sock account with which one votes higher. Thus we simply prohibit sock users. Again, I could probably point out a few cases which would've required checkusering.
    • People can create sock accounts on a whim to troll a person or sock vote.
(16:19:48) Dandy so Dandy: What everything does checkuser tell of the person?
(16:20:00) Auron: the IP.
(16:20:06) Dandy so Dandy: That's it?
(16:20:09) Auron: ...yep.
(16:20:12) Dandy so Dandy: ...
(16:20:14) Dandy so Dandy: Hilarious
(16:20:26) Auron: you can check all the IPs used by an account, all the accounts logged onto by an IP
(16:20:34) Auron: and some bad whois feature that is wrong half the time

I assume that this can be seen a legal issue due to what the IP tells of someone? If not, care to elaborate? ---Chaos- (moo) -- 14:38, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

I think it would be best to keep this discussion on the noticeboard so sannse can see it. Angela (talk) 02:03, December 20, 2009 (UTC)