If someone was running a bar like this in GvG before [pT] did, I apologize. I first saw this bar while guesting for [pT] (I was in [DT] at the time), though it originally had a Resurrection Chant (people weren't brave enough to do deathpact signets), draw conditions (had an SoD monk instead of RC though, if I recall), and a leech signet (was before GW:EN) instead of mirror, ressig, and signet of distraction. They were also the first, to my knowledge, to run this bar in observer mode, therefor I felt the attribution to [pT] was warranted. Pluto 06:17, 3 January 2008 (EST)

Went ahead and removed the attribution line for now. I don't think it's necessary on the build page. Pluto 06:31, 3 January 2008 (EST)

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Me/Mo_GvG_Signet_Mesmer That's the closest thing I could find, so I guess it can stay ;) -StarSeeker | My talk 06:42, 3 January 2008 (EST)

Yeah, saw that build before I posted this. Was thinking of trying to work this into that article, but felt that this build, with its atts and play-style, was a completely different build in spite of the 4 matching skills.. Pluto 07:09, 3 January 2008 (EST)
Got to agree. I guess this can stay. Anyway, about the build... Can't really do much more with it. Maybe add Ignorance to counters? -StarSeeker | My talk 11:14, 3 January 2008 (EST)


Is Complicate that common? Web of Disruption > Complicate in every way (except for this build ofc) so you have a very low chance to play against it. ĐONT*TALK 11:31, 3 January 2008 (EST)

We run it in Automated Tournaments. People spec specifically for it quite often vs [jT], I assure you. Shouldn't be a problem for running it on ladder though. Pluto 11:46, 3 January 2008 (EST)

Sig of Rage makes some srs frenzy lulz. - Rawrawr 18:58, 7 January 2008 (EST)

Yea i believe i saw [jT] running it, ill ask my bud and confirm Chris 21:50, 7 January 2008 (EST)
Pluto's in [jT], iirc. — Skadiddly[슴Mc슴]Diddles 21:52, 7 January 2008 (EST)
Yep. And we've been pretty much running it in every GvG, meaning nearly every AT match seems to have a complicate randomly added to the enemy mesmer. Pluto 05:03, 8 January 2008 (EST)
Then go run something else, in, for example, MAT and abuse their modded bars so you have a advantage over them. - Unexist sig.jpgUnexist 13:47, 20 January 2008 (EST)

Additional variants?

Judge's Insight is a good alternative to strength of honor, and does not have an upkeep. it might be worth mentioning in the variants section. I'm sure retribution might be useful too.

scourge healing could also be useful to help counter healers.

signet of wrath is good versus warriors, and even better because of the reduced recharge thanks to sig of inscriptions.

symbolic posture would allow a greater spammability of the elite sig too, and symbolic celerity would decrease cast time of SoH considerably.

I'm not sure ( actually i doubt) this build has energy problems, but castigation signet could be useful is someone wants some energy income for creating their own variant on this build, although the damage delt is negligable. GAMEfreak 17:52, 9 April 2008 (EDT)


Some guys have been experimenting with this sort of build in PvE for a Mesmer Hero, this build: <pvxbig> [build prof=Me/Mo fas=7+1 dom=5+1 ins=11+1+1 smi=11][Mantra of Inscriptions][Signet of Distraction][Signet of Judgment][Bane Signet][Castigation Signet][Signet of Disenchantment][Purge Signet][Resurrection Signet][/build] </pvxbig>

With Artificer's Signet and a Shield with -2(stance), you have alot of armor, and the build works like a cookie. Also, with upgrades for health, this build is very versatile, strong hex and condition removal, moderate damage and an interrupt. Please comment. ViYadriaanzsig.jpgAdriaanz 08:37, 19 April 2008 (EDT)

Lol, I just obsd two GvG's with 4 different teams and they all used this. ɟoʇuɐʌʎʞɔıɹPanic srsbsns.gif 08:30, 8 May 2008 (EDT)

yeah, this build has been becoming more and more popular these days. Obviously, pT was ahead of its time xD Pluto 10:40, 8 May 2008 (EDT)
It's the 3w 1r with this build thing. It already existed for a while, it's just that many teams now discover it's strong on Ilse Of the Weeping Stone. Only bad thing about it, is that you need a strong ranger. And most euro guild's don't have that type of stuff. —ǘŋƐxɩsƫ 12:31, 8 May 2008 (EDT)


new meta is for dom to be took away and add signet o rage, should the build be changed?--Rebirth Infidel.jpg aesthetic

Artificiers Insignea

Is it worth 40hp to get plus 15al? Basically is it worth it to take artificiers insigneas on your armor instead of full survivors in this case?I Heal If U Shutup 19:01, 15 May 2008 (EDT)

Pretty sure it is. Turns you into a hard target with over 80 unconditional armor (counting shield). Having 80 armor cuts all damage by about 30%. I'd certainly say that's worth more than the +40 health. Pluto 19:10, 15 May 2008 (EDT)

This thing

Is so...so lame...also artificer insignia is very musty. --Super Igor 19px *ninja!!* 16:01, 31 May 2008 (EDT)

Still own or... ?

Nerfed... Syn 17:38, 12 June 2008 (EDT)

The SoH nerf just makes it so that enchant removal isn't a waste of time on the frontliners....I wouldn't say it ruined the build. It does make it harder for a single SoJ mesmer to use tho. The MoI nerf decreases the recharge reduction from 47% to 31% which makes all those signets take 14 secs to recharge instead of 11 which makes it impossible to maintain SoH on one person (counting the casting time). I actually don't think the nerfs were devastating tho. They did hurt the build but not to the point where it is ineffective. Wtbursanswtsizzy 20:20, 12 June 2008 (EDT)

SoJ Nerf

It is still an ranged unconditional KD (only with less damage now). I think there is no need for any change in the build and/or rating. --Rimo 04:11, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

I see no reason for an archive tbh, it's not completely useless Marxon Aurion 05:07, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

Half range hurts tbh Frosty No U! 05:09, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
Half range makes SoJ pretty bad. ɟoʇuɐʌʎʞɔıɹPanic srsbsns.gif 05:30, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
/agreed Frosty No U! 05:31, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
The range isn't really an issue in RA because Arena maps are small, but for GvG half range and lower damage means it will probably see a lot less play. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 05:44, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
It's bad everywhere. You have to run up to them to use it (because as a squishy you're just inside casting range all the time). ɟoʇuɐʌʎʞɔıɹPanic srsbsns.gif 05:58, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
Not in Arenas. You'll have something trying to kill you and/or the other squishies all the time. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 06:03, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
But for GvG... Frosty No U! 06:10, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
...half range and lower damage means it will probably see a lot less play. So give it a little while in case they readjust the skills again and then this probably needs to be duplicated to another page specifically for the standard GvG bar and archived. The RA can probably remain as it is, though the people who voted may want to reconsider their votes since this is probably only "Good" or "Other" now. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 06:21, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

`SoJ still worksw for linebacking though .... ɟoʇuɐʌʎʞɔıɹPanic srsbsns.gif 06:39, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

Really, halfrange casting SoJ isn't really a problem for the mesmers. It's just about positioning, and with a 90 AL dude you're not really troubled with perfect positioning. ViYadriaanzsig.jpgAdriaanz 06:41, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
Mesmer are 90AL now? Wow, nerf plx. ɟoʇuɐʌʎʞɔıɹPanic srsbsns.gif 06:41, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
83 with shield iirc. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 06:45, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
93 with the right shield, actually. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 06:46, 11 July 2008 (EDT)


For the Guru tourney my guild switched SoJ in this build for Signet of Removal. We thought it would give a nice counter to the Water ele meta, and it did. We had great success with it, it allowed our frontline to attack fairly unhindered. What are your thoughts on this change? Gabe 23:06, 12 July 2008 (EDT)

^ Build:Me/Mo SoR Signet Mesmer Frosty No U! 05:57, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

Too mush nerf x)

MoI effect only takes place if the signet was succsessfully activated... This means Dshot SoH = 40sec Recharge..Auch! I do think there many other options better than this (sOR counter Snare ele meta) SoJ is pretty meh.. Half Ranger and Soo little dmg...Massive Image-Massive Sig.jpg 18:32, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

SoJ > all. it is stil a free ranged KD that can serve many purposes. Frosty No U! 18:36, 23 July 2008 (EDT)


We just need 1 Signet Mesmer page with an optional Elite slot. Anyone strongly opposed? Zuranthium 01:44, 25 July 2008 (EDT)

Yes Frosty No U! 01:52, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
You'd also need Holy Wrath for RA and whatever. ــмıкεнaшк 11:03, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
Holy Wrath is not an Elite. Will go in variants though. Zuranthium 22:05, 26 July 2008 (EDT)
You could also put the elite skill in variants and keep SoJ on the main bar. Just FYI. — Rapta Rapta Icon1.gif (talk|contribs) 22:56, 26 July 2008 (EDT)
SoJ is still the main bar. Any other elites should be treated as variants to the standard build. SoR is the only one that even comes close to challenging SoJ for the spot. Pluto 03:03, 1 August 2008 (EDT)

SoJ and SoR should remain separate but these 3:

  1. Build:Me/Mo_GvG_Midnight_Mesmer
  2. Build:Me/Mo_Keystone_Mesmer
  3. Build:Me/Mo_Smiting_Signet_Mesmer

Could probably be merged because they're pretty much anti-melee. SoR is run to counter crap like water eles and ineptitude mesmers. - PANIC! Panic sig4.png sexiness! 09:52, 1 August 2008 (EDT)

Oh shit

It begins, what r gonna happen to dar restz! Frosty No U! 15:15, 31 July 2008 (EDT)

IMO make the elite optional, since SoJ isn't run that much anymore. Frosty No U! 09:37, 1 August 2008 (EDT)


Tbh archive was used like F*** before only some r3000k newbs who runs WS derv runs this Massive Image-Massive Sig.jpg 16:59, 14 September 2008 (EDT)

You're both mad, and bad. Rawrawr Dinosaur 19:25, 30 December 2008 (EST)
Wait, wat? Frostrage.jpgFrosty po! 19:28, 30 December 2008 (EST)

Use with RoJ imo :D RickyRicksawsmface.PNGvantof 19:29, 30 December 2008 (EST)

SoH Nerf.

Any reason still running this at all ? :S Atleast no point using Insp prayers anymore .. Which means your SoR will have 5sec recharge whit = makes this baed :> Massive Image-Massive Sig.jpg 09:11, 6 February 2009 (EST)

SoH nerf sucks hard. I hate it. ---Chaos- 09:17, 6 February 2009 (EST)
Comming from a rangers point of view; YES! Greeeaaat, one less thing to do in GvG :D Massive Image-Massive Sig.jpg 09:55, 6 February 2009 (EST)
Don't forget Dom mesmers use Mesmer skills *lol* --Srs Bean Mafia. Srs Beans R Srs 09:58, 6 February 2009 (EST)

yeh archive thisCloseCloseImpactSW.jpgImpactPet Whale 06:55, 8 February 2009 (EST)